Robin Di Angelo was on the BBC spouting some garbage like the text from the study about 5 years back. Another contributor said she made it sound like racism was genetic. Di Angelo said that, no it was cultural and Europe had the exact same issues as the states, *because* of the states- much to the bafflement of the other panelists. There are 44 countries in Europe. Only two speak English. Most weren’t involved either in their overseas colonialism or the transatlantic slave trade. Some, such as Ireland, Greece and the Baltic States, were colonies. The notion that a Pole, whose country was involved in neither, is 99% white, and doesn’t even speak English has inherited some supposed ethnic guilt because of US influence, is the most pronounced example of cultural imperialism thinkable. I am getting tired of woke US hucksters using the term “Western” as a marketing gimmick to hawk their wares.
I was having a discussion with a friend about systemic racism and he said "are you telling me black people aren't overrepresented in Russian jail system?"
There are black people in Russia, but ,like most non-white people they are a product of post ww2 migration. Orwell wrote in the 40's about how the American military tried to enforce segregation in the areas where they were based, much to the outrage and non-compliance of the locals- same energy as people like DI Angelo, just the inverse ideology.
Do you live in Russia, Anna? Do you live in Europe? And, as many criticisms as I may have of Russians, I would say they'd be gobsmacked to see a black person, this isn't 14th century, they have TV and the internet just like you.
It's a sign of the times that I really cannot tell if the question "are you telling me black people aren't overrepresented in Russian jails" is a racist question or an anti-racist one.
Ireland did have a slavery culture for a while. Their slaves where primairly English tho. (Fun fact St Patrick was a slave at one point). There’s also the salient point that the word slave comes from Slav.
My point was that not only were Slavs not involved in the transatlantic slave trade but that they also suffered from large slave trade, which should make them “victims” not oppressors. Plus that no one in America seems to realize there were an awful lot of white slavery going on for a really long time.
I think everyone understands that slavery wasn't always race-based. But in the USA it became race-based. The difference between race-based and non-race-based slavery is how easy it is to discriminate who is a slave, or who was a slave, even after slavery has ended. That's what systemic racism is.
True on both points. But if I am being fair, I don't think they argue white people weren't slaves, but that black people were the victims of a race-based slavery, perpetuated by white people in the US and European colonial empires. Which is a gross oversimplification of history, but, then, nuance has never been their strong suit.
I have had fibromyalgia for nearly 25 years and have had terrible bouts of chronic fatigue, and I remain skeptical that long Covid is very prevalent—which I now know has made Taylor Lorenz think that I am a terrible person. I think I have a leg to stand on about all of this, Taylor!
The problem is that ALL these things exist. But so do people who won’t stop going to the doctors about not feeling 💯 every single day who have nothing wrong with them except a refusal to live a more psychologically and physically healthy life. And there’s no test we can do to discriminate between them.
I know this all from long experience. My partner had ME post mono as a teenager that took her out for 18 months, then made a full recovery until covid brought it roaring back. Went from the “has to be doing something 20hrs a day or she vibrates hard enough to start a fire” kind of person to having to choose whether to shower or make toast, because that’s all she’s gonna have energy for today. She has made 100% recovery now but she was sick for almost two years.
But I also work as a doctor, and malingerers are also a completely real phenomenon.
I wish there was more of a culture of reassurance. There's nothing wrong with feeling chest pain and going to see a doctor. There's nothing wrong with the doctor running a few tests and concluding that it's probably reflux or a muscle strain or something and telling the patient that it's good news, they're probably not having a heart attack.
This isn’t that uncommon- really half the chest pains I see are musculoskeletal and I always tell people that it’s my job to tell what’s a heart attack and what isn’t, not theirs.
However, when it’s someone’s 20th return to the clinic in 6 months and they’ve already had an angiogram which was completely normal and been told that their chest pain is definitely NOT a heart attack and actually they need to get their anxiety sorted, I’m gonna start getting reassuring because they are now actively stealing the resource of my time from people who need it.
Well yes. My concern is the people who won't take "you're fine" for an answer. There is a small population of patients for whom only a bad doctor would tell them that their symptoms are not from some serious illness, and those people do tend to use a lot of our time.
Malinging and work: I really really hate my current job. My exhaustion/anxiety symptoms are extremely pronounced lately. Usually I sleep well on Friday and Saturday night and I have a good Sunday.
Why should we bother working? I make good money and still can't buy a house in Canada. I may as well fake stress leave to get a 3 month long weekend. I'm not going to do that, I'm working through stuff and compartmentalizing my ridiculous job and limiting the harm it can cause. But my job requires mental focus and I can't mentally focus without "caring" which means I can't totally isolate the suffering like a stubbed toe.
I wouldn't be surprised if Post-covid and other Malingering disorders were related to people hating their lives.
I mean it definitely is that, but there’s fuck all I can do about it, and you’re getting in the way of me seeing someone who’s actually sick! Please just sort your life out 🙏
Long covid is prevalent but seems to be both over and under diagnosed. I've posted here about my sister who developed it before, and two other people I know developed it. This was all in 2020, so I am not sure how prevalent it is after subsequent variants. I have lupus and emphysema and it took me months to get back to baseline after contracting Omicron, but I didn't, and don't think I had long covid, just intermittent tachycardia and parosmia that resolved, and a partially collapsed lung that also thankfully healed.
Exactly! Seems like the problem was that prominent journalists were treating Long Covid like some mysterious malevolent ailment instead of a combination of conditions related to respiratory health. All sorts of people working in respiratory therapy recognized the basics and were treating people.
To be clear, my sister does have long covid, related more to vascular and neurological damage from the virus in her case. She had very few, if any, respiratory symptoms when she had covid in 2020, her complications were almost all vascular in nature (clotting, dissection, cardiac arrest)
So sorry, that sounds awful and challenging to say the least.
What I was trying to get at was that it was being presented as an alien virus while the mechanisms were more understood- extreme immune reactions, vascular and cardiac therapy and systems are more understood currently. I’m no doctor or rehab therapist.
Tema Okun is definitely on my shit list. A few neurotic individuals at my otherwise amazing job got ahold of her text, and the general atmosphere in the office has become tense ever since. Following the reading of The List, which I'm sure the reader thought made her very, very brave, office harmony started cracking. Following a series of mandatory race-based affinity group meetings later, morale has cratered. They've tried to rebrand it several times. It's not working. I suspect that DEI is often implemented to be the bandaid over the bullet hole of other institutional issues, though.
We're way more divided than we were before these attempts to make us good people or whatever. Thankfully, DEI fatigue has set in and enough people are checked out or have quit that there might be light at the end of this tunnel. I have hope we can return to our former selves a little wiser, but it's taking a while!
Leadership is terrified to appear racist or non-inclusive, I believe. Any time it's brought up, howls of us abandoning 'the work' tend to drown out the possibility that the 'work' might be why everyone's nervous and retreating from one another rather than being a cohesive team. Those accusations hold less and less weight as more studies come out that this is all very dumb waste of time.
But I completely agree with you. Many DEI issues are just skirting around leadership and culture gaps.
Leadership might be shocked what would happen if they just took a firm stand and let the angry people leave, a la Basecamp and Coin Desk - and how many people would be relieved. Anyways, best of luck.
We have a lot of very specialized employees, but if we scraped all the In This House We Believe shit off our application process, I imagine we might attract more pleasant individuals.
This is why I think Christian values are better than the nihilism of critical studies. Kindness, generosity, and forgiveness. Forgiveness is a gift to oneself. It frees us from resentment. Resentment is a powerful emotion and can cause us to act in ways that we later regret.
If most Christians were genuinely Christ-like, I'd be all for it. When I encounter people who do live that way, they are lovely, warm people. Real givers. I just don't think they're the majority. It is typically women, and they are usually taken advantage of for these characteristics.
I see Christian 'values' used in the same way as gender ideology: to coerce, control, and benefit some far more than others. Financially enriching those at the top to obscene levels. Disproportionate kindness demanded of some, while others receive unending forgiveness despite often terrible acts.
"God told me to" is materially the same as "I want." "I know God forgives me"? It's just "Can we please stop talking about the bad thing I did." Christianity and gender ideology are both terrible at accountability, but great at witch hunts.
You may get your way regardless, as a lot of people in the gender cult will whiplash over to the lord in the aftermath to seek high control environments in a different flavor.
Absolutely! But I do see both ideologies providing cover and tools for the shitty people to keep others in line. One is not inherently good because another sucks. Both of these ideologies broadly feel the other is wrong while employing similar tactics to keep the flock together and obedient.
Individuals are individuals, this is true. There can be absolute gems who subscribe to these beliefs while the belief systems exert power and control over the adherents.
The professionalism of this pod is really slipping. I had no had idea what I was listening to until 23 minutes into the pod when they finally told me that this is in fact a podcast and that I was listening blocked and reported with jesse and katie. As long time fan, jesse and katie need to get their act in gear and show a little respect for their audience. If I am left in such a state of confusion again I will cancel my subscription immediately, once I figure out what it is that I am listening to
So you clicked on the podcast in your feed that has the Blocked and Reported logo, and listened to the same people you hear every week and yet you still needed assurances that yes, this the right podcast?
For all they knew they could have been listening to INFOWARS or whatever Alex Jones is shilling nowadays. The fact that Jessie and Katie tell the listeners that this IS INDEED A PODCAST is super important to the Primos
I agree. I just think it is a funny intro and i think their lapse in professionalism is funny too, which I don't think is lost on jesse and katie. Please don't stop your doing your intros in a haphazard manner jesse and katie. It is great
I'm the opposite of the people who get frustrated by their doctors saying things are psychosomatic--I want to believe that ALL issues I might have are at least somewhat psychosomatic, probably because it makes me feel like I have more potential control over them.
Someone I know claims to be able to mentally control excruciating physical pain (broke his back years ago). He 'visualises it as a golf ball and strikes it off into the distance'. Felt like it would be fun to be able to strike something off into the distance at that moment.
When I was a child I had recurrent ear infections and drains and tubes and whatnot. The pain was awful. I remember visualizing a glass beaker with red liquid in it, and I would (in my mind) slowly pour blue liquid in until the colors mixed through purple then almost completely blue. The red (obvs.) was the pain, etc., etc. I don’t remember how well this worked, but it’s one of my only childhood memories and I did it a lot, so I assume it provided some kind of relief.
It’s not something I can really visualize the same way now…
I commented in a different thread, but I really hate my job right now and it requires unceasing mental focus. I have an incredible set of doctors who handle my Hemophilia and I am having physical symptoms which kind of align with my bleeding disorder so I get good investigative care. Neverending neck pain and headaches could be white-hot hatred of my job leaking into my body, or it could be from hitting my head a week ago, or the experimental clotting medication I'm using.
A bunch of stuff coming together to mean I feel like spending some of our healthcare dollars to figure out if I'm going to have a stroke vs. need to work 37.5 hours a week for the next few months to increase my sanity.
I'm really trying to figure out if this is 100% psychosomatic vs 60% vs 20%. :)
On the up-side, I slept great last night and it's time to focus intently on a project I hate.
I’m currently living in Portland, Oregon, never ever in a million years been a swing city or state, and I received almost daily calls and texts from phone banking volunteers. I kid you not, over the last few months I have ~300 unread election texts. I thought I was just going to have to vote Trump in protest. Of course, a very ineffective protest, but a protest nonetheless.
The Vote Forward stuff was the worst! It's a good thing I received it after I'd already voted early, so I couldn't be tempted to do something contrarian in protest. I can't imagine feeling positively toward a campaign after reading that smarm.
I read all these "Trump's campaign has no ground game" headlines this past summer. I guess you don't need to get out the vote when your opponent is doing it for you.
I live in a suburb outside Philly so am definitely in one of the most heavily contested electoral areas. Thankfully I don’t use my phone number to sign up for all kinds of online sites, or memberships so I only received around 8 texts everyday for the last 3 months of the election cycle. My mom, whom is a republican and uses her phone number for all the Boomer ass shit she does received upward of 30 texts a day starting in June.
Nope. I'm also in the NW suburbs and 8 texts a day is about right. And you should see my mailbox. Every day 4 mailers from both parties. I would put them straight in the trash, but apparently my kindergartener read some because he told me to vote based on a Harris mailer.
Me: "So you believe Harris is going to do that?"
Kid: "It said so on a postcard."
Me: "Well if it said so on a postcard it must be true."
I pretty much only got texts on the Dem side from people I’d given to (Harder, Casey, Fetterman). But my phone number belonged to some guy in rural Ohio like 10 years ago (but still shows up on his digital slime trail) and I was getting three or four *phone calls* a day from Republican phonebankers toward the end. And can confirm texts from Ohio numbers in daily double-digit numbers.
While it’s fair for NYT and Bloomberg to hold off on covering this study until it is peer reviewed or the findings are replicated, it’s also fair to note that the same rigour has not always been applied at these publications when reporting on science that supports certain political views (of course I’m thinking of research on the trans suicide, but really any social psych study on implicit racial bias qualifies too).
I also found this quite interesting (from the above article):
“However, an editor — Nabila Ahmed, the team leader for Global Equality at Bloomberg News who “lead[s] a global team of reporters focused on stories that elevate issues of race, gender, diversity and fairness within companies, governments and societies” — informed the NCRI on November 15 that Bloomberg would not go forward with the article.
The NCRI asked for either a scientific or journalistic explanation, and Ahmed directed the researchers to Anna Kitanaka, the executive editor of Bloomberg Equality. Kitanaka told the NCRI that what stories get published and when is entirely an “editorial decision,” and did not provide details on why the publication axed the article.”
Maybe Bloomberg’s decision to drop the story was completely unrelated to the subject matter, but it really doesn’t look good when the DEI editor (described above more like having a cause than a beat) is the one to axe the story. The further referral to the executive editor of Bloomberg Equality (which has an entire section on its site devoted to “DEI Backlash”: https://www.bloomberg.com/equality) is enough to make any reasonable person uneasy about how the editor arrived at her decision.
Regardless, I am hopeful that this is the first of many studies examining the effects of DEI trainings/orthodoxy. Given that this is one of the first studies on this subject matter that I’ve come across that actually has a control group, I think it’s a much better start on the path to understanding this topic than the Tumblr wisdom, pieced together critical theory, and vibes that have constituted what we know about the effects of these programs up to now.
All of this comes with the caveat that I too am highly skeptical about the results of many psych experiments having applications outside of the lab. However, we also have to remember that the road to a solid meta-analysis starts with a single study. Let’s hope there are more researchers willing to tackle this subject matter despite the social cost that they might face at their institutions.
I think this is the major issue with many psych studies. Eighteen year old undergrads acting as a representative sample for everybody else in society never sat well with me.
These tid bits are indeed very damning. Having the DEI advocates can it is nothing like “usual editorial bullshit,” as it was described. Jesse, if you read this, did you know this?
Also I agree the studies sound a bit flimsy (and agree that this wouldn’t be a barrier to being discussed in the news if they found the opposite result)
Katie and Jesse take a very deserved victory lap, sounding more lighthearted than they have in recent episodes. I kept laughing aloud over my post-Thanksgiving dishes.
I'm still not going to admit to IRL friends that I love this podcast, but episodes like this one do give me hope!
On the JK Rowling thing: the suggestion that the Nazis burned down sex research facilities solely or even in large part due to "transphobia," is a lie of ommission. They viewed any kind of research on sex as "degenerate," and targeted homosexuals much more blatantly. There wasn't much of a distinction between cross-dressing and transsexualism back then; it was all just kind of lumped together in the broad category of "sexual deviance," especially in the eyes of the Nazi party. If any trans people were killed in the holocaust, it was for reasons other than being trans, most likely for either being Jewish or being homosexual.
There are records of who was killed for being gay, and there are accounts from gay people who survived the death camps (often to end up in prison after the war ended.) If so many trans people died in the holocaust, where are there names? Where are the stories from the ones who narrowly survived? I'd like to note for the record that one of the pioneers of the modern penile inversion vaginoplasty, Edwin Gohrbandt was himself a member of the Nazi party and even conducted experiments on prisoners at Dachau. If they were supposedly so transphobic, why did they employ this guy after he researched sex changes?
It's idiotic enough that they've tried to re-write history to make Stonewall all about themselves, but now they're trying to graft themselves onto the Holocaust as well. Ridiculous and offensive.
The most important point of why the man’s sex clinic was targeted was because he was JEWISH. He was a Jewish researcher about sex. Lgbt groups say the nazis were targeting them, but they were mostly targeting the fact the guy was Jewish. His partner who actually performed the sex change operations wasn’t Jewish and he went on to be in charge of the human experiments at Dachau (I think). I can’t remember the article I read about this but that article even said most gay men who were arrested were put in regular jail unless they were Jewish then they were sent to the camps. So this idea that lgbt people were specifically targeted is missing the main point: jews were the targets.
Also, sorry my tone is definitely angry in this comment. It’s not directed at you Wendy, just these asinine people who want to make everything about transness and gender woo. It’s so exhausting and it’s everywhere.
I didn't take your anger to be directed at me, haha. I understand completely; the experiences of other marginalized groups are ostensibly being appropriated by TRAs to bolster their narrative. If I recall correctly, there was actually a dropoff in the number of people being detained solely for homosexuality around 1940, because Hitler's priorities shifted to POWs and full-on extermination of Jewish people.
I think there's a discussion to be had about how poorly gay survivors (Jewish and gentile) were treated after the war, but that's less about who Hitler targeted in the Holocaust and more about the overall sociopolitical environment in the West at the time. The fact that some innocent people went from concentration camps to prison is unconscionable, and that particular component was the work of allied forces. As WWII retreats further into the past, more people tend to forget that fighting injustices against marginalized civilians was not the top priority of the Allied nations. Hitler was a uniquely evil man because he excelled at exploiting the bigotries that were latent in many people at the time, and he know how to weaponize them to accomplish truly horrific things. Both of my grandfathers served in WWII, and they both said blatantly antisemitic things on a somewhat regular basis, even after having personally witnessed the crimes of the Axis powers.
If people want to unpack historical injustices against Jews and gay people (among others), they have to acknowledge that the groundwork was laid for those crimes by pervasive endemic prejudices. The Nazis weaponized bigotry to the deadliest extent, but by no means was it unique to them.
Oh my gods Jesse do not join Blue Sky. You already cannot safely handle Twitter without getting into exhausting arguments with people who are not engaging in good faith.
I also joined Blue Sky out of curiosity and it's so boring, basically every post it shows me as "recommended" is Erin Reed (or equivalent) on trans issues or someone posting incredibly boring shit like "fuck Trump that's the message!" or "wow why does no one ever say eggs are ok for lunch, break breakfast boundaries y'all!".
If "All Lives Matter" is wrong, then it's certainly wrong to take the Holocaust and remove the specificity of it.
The Nazis burned Magnus Hirsch's library because he was JEWISH and subversive. The fact that he wrote about sexual and gender dysphoria (among other things) was secondary. Calling J.K. Rowling a "Holocaust Denier" is extremely dishonest.
In fact, the Nazis made a big production out of holding simultaneous book burnings in 34 towns. The fact that one of the book burnings contained books about sexual dysphoria is a footnote at best. (See https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/book-burning )
From this article about which books were burned:
> Other writers included on the blacklists were American authors Jack London, Theodore Dreiser, and Helen Keller, whose belief in social justice encouraged her to champion the disabled, pacifism, improved conditions for industrial workers, and women's voting rights.
We don't hear deaf-blind people saying that Hitler's first, primary victims were the deaf-blind simply because they burned Helen Keller's books.
I don’t usually comment on these, but the long weekend has given me too much free time so I just wanna say that I’m glad BarPod is addressing the DEI study Colin Wright wrote about but the state media ignored. I just read all the linked articles and will listen to the pod later. 😪
Robin Di Angelo was on the BBC spouting some garbage like the text from the study about 5 years back. Another contributor said she made it sound like racism was genetic. Di Angelo said that, no it was cultural and Europe had the exact same issues as the states, *because* of the states- much to the bafflement of the other panelists. There are 44 countries in Europe. Only two speak English. Most weren’t involved either in their overseas colonialism or the transatlantic slave trade. Some, such as Ireland, Greece and the Baltic States, were colonies. The notion that a Pole, whose country was involved in neither, is 99% white, and doesn’t even speak English has inherited some supposed ethnic guilt because of US influence, is the most pronounced example of cultural imperialism thinkable. I am getting tired of woke US hucksters using the term “Western” as a marketing gimmick to hawk their wares.
I was having a discussion with a friend about systemic racism and he said "are you telling me black people aren't overrepresented in Russian jail system?"
There are black people in Russia, but ,like most non-white people they are a product of post ww2 migration. Orwell wrote in the 40's about how the American military tried to enforce segregation in the areas where they were based, much to the outrage and non-compliance of the locals- same energy as people like DI Angelo, just the inverse ideology.
There some African students in Moscow, but no black people outside of it
No, there are also some black people who've settled there and had children, either amongst themselves, or with ethnic Russians.
The point is, jails aren't filled with black people
Oh, Anna, I never said there were black people in prisons in Russia.
Maybe 3 of them. It's still a big deal to see a black person in Russia, something you'd write home about
Do you live in Russia, Anna? Do you live in Europe? And, as many criticisms as I may have of Russians, I would say they'd be gobsmacked to see a black person, this isn't 14th century, they have TV and the internet just like you.
It's a sign of the times that I really cannot tell if the question "are you telling me black people aren't overrepresented in Russian jails" is a racist question or an anti-racist one.
No he was being anti racist
“Wat?”
Ireland did have a slavery culture for a while. Their slaves where primairly English tho. (Fun fact St Patrick was a slave at one point). There’s also the salient point that the word slave comes from Slav.
I never said there wasn't slavery in Europe, I said most of the 44 countries weren't involved in the transatlantic slave trade.
My point was that not only were Slavs not involved in the transatlantic slave trade but that they also suffered from large slave trade, which should make them “victims” not oppressors. Plus that no one in America seems to realize there were an awful lot of white slavery going on for a really long time.
I think everyone understands that slavery wasn't always race-based. But in the USA it became race-based. The difference between race-based and non-race-based slavery is how easy it is to discriminate who is a slave, or who was a slave, even after slavery has ended. That's what systemic racism is.
Except there were a decent number of free blacks particularly in the north...
Yes but they would have been required to keep documents that prove their freedom. White people didn't.
True on both points. But if I am being fair, I don't think they argue white people weren't slaves, but that black people were the victims of a race-based slavery, perpetuated by white people in the US and European colonial empires. Which is a gross oversimplification of history, but, then, nuance has never been their strong suit.
The Vikings had a slavery culture. Their slaves were Irish, among other peoples.
I have had fibromyalgia for nearly 25 years and have had terrible bouts of chronic fatigue, and I remain skeptical that long Covid is very prevalent—which I now know has made Taylor Lorenz think that I am a terrible person. I think I have a leg to stand on about all of this, Taylor!
The problem is that ALL these things exist. But so do people who won’t stop going to the doctors about not feeling 💯 every single day who have nothing wrong with them except a refusal to live a more psychologically and physically healthy life. And there’s no test we can do to discriminate between them.
I know this all from long experience. My partner had ME post mono as a teenager that took her out for 18 months, then made a full recovery until covid brought it roaring back. Went from the “has to be doing something 20hrs a day or she vibrates hard enough to start a fire” kind of person to having to choose whether to shower or make toast, because that’s all she’s gonna have energy for today. She has made 100% recovery now but she was sick for almost two years.
But I also work as a doctor, and malingerers are also a completely real phenomenon.
I wish there was more of a culture of reassurance. There's nothing wrong with feeling chest pain and going to see a doctor. There's nothing wrong with the doctor running a few tests and concluding that it's probably reflux or a muscle strain or something and telling the patient that it's good news, they're probably not having a heart attack.
This isn’t that uncommon- really half the chest pains I see are musculoskeletal and I always tell people that it’s my job to tell what’s a heart attack and what isn’t, not theirs.
However, when it’s someone’s 20th return to the clinic in 6 months and they’ve already had an angiogram which was completely normal and been told that their chest pain is definitely NOT a heart attack and actually they need to get their anxiety sorted, I’m gonna start getting reassuring because they are now actively stealing the resource of my time from people who need it.
Well yes. My concern is the people who won't take "you're fine" for an answer. There is a small population of patients for whom only a bad doctor would tell them that their symptoms are not from some serious illness, and those people do tend to use a lot of our time.
Yeah there are plenty of them. We know them as “heart sinks”, though we aren’t allowed to say so now.
*getting less reassuring
Amen!!
Malinging and work: I really really hate my current job. My exhaustion/anxiety symptoms are extremely pronounced lately. Usually I sleep well on Friday and Saturday night and I have a good Sunday.
Why should we bother working? I make good money and still can't buy a house in Canada. I may as well fake stress leave to get a 3 month long weekend. I'm not going to do that, I'm working through stuff and compartmentalizing my ridiculous job and limiting the harm it can cause. But my job requires mental focus and I can't mentally focus without "caring" which means I can't totally isolate the suffering like a stubbed toe.
I wouldn't be surprised if Post-covid and other Malingering disorders were related to people hating their lives.
I mean it definitely is that, but there’s fuck all I can do about it, and you’re getting in the way of me seeing someone who’s actually sick! Please just sort your life out 🙏
Dude, even Taylor “the angel of the internet” Lorenz who loves everyone thinks you’re a horrible person? Might have to rethink things now.
Long covid is prevalent but seems to be both over and under diagnosed. I've posted here about my sister who developed it before, and two other people I know developed it. This was all in 2020, so I am not sure how prevalent it is after subsequent variants. I have lupus and emphysema and it took me months to get back to baseline after contracting Omicron, but I didn't, and don't think I had long covid, just intermittent tachycardia and parosmia that resolved, and a partially collapsed lung that also thankfully healed.
Exactly! Seems like the problem was that prominent journalists were treating Long Covid like some mysterious malevolent ailment instead of a combination of conditions related to respiratory health. All sorts of people working in respiratory therapy recognized the basics and were treating people.
To be clear, my sister does have long covid, related more to vascular and neurological damage from the virus in her case. She had very few, if any, respiratory symptoms when she had covid in 2020, her complications were almost all vascular in nature (clotting, dissection, cardiac arrest)
So sorry, that sounds awful and challenging to say the least.
What I was trying to get at was that it was being presented as an alien virus while the mechanisms were more understood- extreme immune reactions, vascular and cardiac therapy and systems are more understood currently. I’m no doctor or rehab therapist.
Oddly enough I could say the same thing, though I think the fibromyalgia diagnosis only goes back 20 years or so for me.
Wait, Jesse is no longer on the market? Does Jesse have a GF?
Yes. Happy for him but it’s a very dark day for all the Jesse-cels.
I was so pumped as well. I announced it to both my kids during big boy breakfast hour.
Big Boy Breakfast hour is making me laugh
It’s super serious for when my sons and I are up before my wife.
That's so sweet, they'll have fond memories of this, I'm sure. You sound like a great Dad!
My husband needs to get on this bandwagon.
It will help if you sleep in super late
I don't, that's why it will never be anything but wishful thinking. We are more likely to get Big Boy Midnight Snack.
The episode should have been an elongated 20 question about if Jesse will change his last name and who this mysterious horse is
Jesse is dating a furry now?
Yeah, I'm glad he's got privacy, but also this tidbit makes me happy for him. Good luck, Jesse and Mystery Woman!
One month of Primo membership says the mystery woman is Brianna Wu, and he's now one part of a throuple!
If she's the woman who joined him at the NYC show this summer, I can confirm she is not a horse.
So, when asked if she is a horse, you would say "nay?"
(I'll see myself out)
Yes I think I met her too. Big height difference, but same species.
So, she’s a Shetland?
Mystery horse *
* Dark horse
Heather is cheating on Bret?
Taking bets on whether it’s that or whether Jesse’s gone full MGTOW
Tema Okun is definitely on my shit list. A few neurotic individuals at my otherwise amazing job got ahold of her text, and the general atmosphere in the office has become tense ever since. Following the reading of The List, which I'm sure the reader thought made her very, very brave, office harmony started cracking. Following a series of mandatory race-based affinity group meetings later, morale has cratered. They've tried to rebrand it several times. It's not working. I suspect that DEI is often implemented to be the bandaid over the bullet hole of other institutional issues, though.
We're way more divided than we were before these attempts to make us good people or whatever. Thankfully, DEI fatigue has set in and enough people are checked out or have quit that there might be light at the end of this tunnel. I have hope we can return to our former selves a little wiser, but it's taking a while!
Where the hell is leadership? Crazy how long CEO’s let this crap go on.
Leadership is terrified to appear racist or non-inclusive, I believe. Any time it's brought up, howls of us abandoning 'the work' tend to drown out the possibility that the 'work' might be why everyone's nervous and retreating from one another rather than being a cohesive team. Those accusations hold less and less weight as more studies come out that this is all very dumb waste of time.
But I completely agree with you. Many DEI issues are just skirting around leadership and culture gaps.
Leadership might be shocked what would happen if they just took a firm stand and let the angry people leave, a la Basecamp and Coin Desk - and how many people would be relieved. Anyways, best of luck.
It would be a much nicer place to work!
We have a lot of very specialized employees, but if we scraped all the In This House We Believe shit off our application process, I imagine we might attract more pleasant individuals.
> howls of us abandoning 'the work'
Unless you work at the NAACP, then "the work" is getting your widgets or whatever built.
That's the less important work! The real work is making you a better person, bigot!
This is why I think Christian values are better than the nihilism of critical studies. Kindness, generosity, and forgiveness. Forgiveness is a gift to oneself. It frees us from resentment. Resentment is a powerful emotion and can cause us to act in ways that we later regret.
If most Christians were genuinely Christ-like, I'd be all for it. When I encounter people who do live that way, they are lovely, warm people. Real givers. I just don't think they're the majority. It is typically women, and they are usually taken advantage of for these characteristics.
I see Christian 'values' used in the same way as gender ideology: to coerce, control, and benefit some far more than others. Financially enriching those at the top to obscene levels. Disproportionate kindness demanded of some, while others receive unending forgiveness despite often terrible acts.
"God told me to" is materially the same as "I want." "I know God forgives me"? It's just "Can we please stop talking about the bad thing I did." Christianity and gender ideology are both terrible at accountability, but great at witch hunts.
You may get your way regardless, as a lot of people in the gender cult will whiplash over to the lord in the aftermath to seek high control environments in a different flavor.
The truth is, there are nice people and shitty people and it really doesn't have to do with what overarching value system they subscribe to.
Absolutely! But I do see both ideologies providing cover and tools for the shitty people to keep others in line. One is not inherently good because another sucks. Both of these ideologies broadly feel the other is wrong while employing similar tactics to keep the flock together and obedient.
Individuals are individuals, this is true. There can be absolute gems who subscribe to these beliefs while the belief systems exert power and control over the adherents.
The professionalism of this pod is really slipping. I had no had idea what I was listening to until 23 minutes into the pod when they finally told me that this is in fact a podcast and that I was listening blocked and reported with jesse and katie. As long time fan, jesse and katie need to get their act in gear and show a little respect for their audience. If I am left in such a state of confusion again I will cancel my subscription immediately, once I figure out what it is that I am listening to
So you clicked on the podcast in your feed that has the Blocked and Reported logo, and listened to the same people you hear every week and yet you still needed assurances that yes, this the right podcast?
I think it was a joke.
For all they knew they could have been listening to INFOWARS or whatever Alex Jones is shilling nowadays. The fact that Jessie and Katie tell the listeners that this IS INDEED A PODCAST is super important to the Primos
Yes... Is that too much to ask for?
I think he just disguises his irony very well.
(Hahaha! Well done.)
It's okay to introduce your show, even if it's redundant for most listeners.
I agree. I just think it is a funny intro and i think their lapse in professionalism is funny too, which I don't think is lost on jesse and katie. Please don't stop your doing your intros in a haphazard manner jesse and katie. It is great
I'm the opposite of the people who get frustrated by their doctors saying things are psychosomatic--I want to believe that ALL issues I might have are at least somewhat psychosomatic, probably because it makes me feel like I have more potential control over them.
Someone I know claims to be able to mentally control excruciating physical pain (broke his back years ago). He 'visualises it as a golf ball and strikes it off into the distance'. Felt like it would be fun to be able to strike something off into the distance at that moment.
When I was a child I had recurrent ear infections and drains and tubes and whatnot. The pain was awful. I remember visualizing a glass beaker with red liquid in it, and I would (in my mind) slowly pour blue liquid in until the colors mixed through purple then almost completely blue. The red (obvs.) was the pain, etc., etc. I don’t remember how well this worked, but it’s one of my only childhood memories and I did it a lot, so I assume it provided some kind of relief.
It’s not something I can really visualize the same way now…
Christian Scientist here
(I play the villain in the "Get Boosted" PSA's on Youtube)
You are not alone! We believe all disease and physical problems are ultimately a mental experience which can be reversed/destroyed.
There's a whole theology behind this (which i'll spare you) but if you're totally bored one day, you can look at our stuff and test it.
and then there's germ theory....
No offence, but I'm probably going to a doctor rather than a theologist.
I commented in a different thread, but I really hate my job right now and it requires unceasing mental focus. I have an incredible set of doctors who handle my Hemophilia and I am having physical symptoms which kind of align with my bleeding disorder so I get good investigative care. Neverending neck pain and headaches could be white-hot hatred of my job leaking into my body, or it could be from hitting my head a week ago, or the experimental clotting medication I'm using.
A bunch of stuff coming together to mean I feel like spending some of our healthcare dollars to figure out if I'm going to have a stroke vs. need to work 37.5 hours a week for the next few months to increase my sanity.
I'm really trying to figure out if this is 100% psychosomatic vs 60% vs 20%. :)
On the up-side, I slept great last night and it's time to focus intently on a project I hate.
I’m currently living in Portland, Oregon, never ever in a million years been a swing city or state, and I received almost daily calls and texts from phone banking volunteers. I kid you not, over the last few months I have ~300 unread election texts. I thought I was just going to have to vote Trump in protest. Of course, a very ineffective protest, but a protest nonetheless.
The Vote Forward stuff was the worst! It's a good thing I received it after I'd already voted early, so I couldn't be tempted to do something contrarian in protest. I can't imagine feeling positively toward a campaign after reading that smarm.
I read all these "Trump's campaign has no ground game" headlines this past summer. I guess you don't need to get out the vote when your opponent is doing it for you.
I live in a suburb outside Philly so am definitely in one of the most heavily contested electoral areas. Thankfully I don’t use my phone number to sign up for all kinds of online sites, or memberships so I only received around 8 texts everyday for the last 3 months of the election cycle. My mom, whom is a republican and uses her phone number for all the Boomer ass shit she does received upward of 30 texts a day starting in June.
“Only received around 8 texts a day” is INSANE. I thought it was satire. Thirty a day is unconscionable! There has to be a better way
Nope. I'm also in the NW suburbs and 8 texts a day is about right. And you should see my mailbox. Every day 4 mailers from both parties. I would put them straight in the trash, but apparently my kindergartener read some because he told me to vote based on a Harris mailer.
Me: "So you believe Harris is going to do that?"
Kid: "It said so on a postcard."
Me: "Well if it said so on a postcard it must be true."
Kid: "It was a *shiny* postcard."
I started actively telling them if they didn’t stop cornering me a couple times a day I vote trump. It did not help.
I pretty much only got texts on the Dem side from people I’d given to (Harder, Casey, Fetterman). But my phone number belonged to some guy in rural Ohio like 10 years ago (but still shows up on his digital slime trail) and I was getting three or four *phone calls* a day from Republican phonebankers toward the end. And can confirm texts from Ohio numbers in daily double-digit numbers.
I first read about the DEI study that was the subject of this episode in The National Review. I thought Abigail Anthony did a pretty good job reasonably detailing the study as well as the circumstances around the stories being dropped at NYT and Bloomberg: https://www.nationalreview.com/news/dei-training-increases-perception-of-non-existent-prejudice-agreement-with-hitler-rhetoric-study-finds/
While it’s fair for NYT and Bloomberg to hold off on covering this study until it is peer reviewed or the findings are replicated, it’s also fair to note that the same rigour has not always been applied at these publications when reporting on science that supports certain political views (of course I’m thinking of research on the trans suicide, but really any social psych study on implicit racial bias qualifies too).
I also found this quite interesting (from the above article):
“However, an editor — Nabila Ahmed, the team leader for Global Equality at Bloomberg News who “lead[s] a global team of reporters focused on stories that elevate issues of race, gender, diversity and fairness within companies, governments and societies” — informed the NCRI on November 15 that Bloomberg would not go forward with the article.
The NCRI asked for either a scientific or journalistic explanation, and Ahmed directed the researchers to Anna Kitanaka, the executive editor of Bloomberg Equality. Kitanaka told the NCRI that what stories get published and when is entirely an “editorial decision,” and did not provide details on why the publication axed the article.”
Maybe Bloomberg’s decision to drop the story was completely unrelated to the subject matter, but it really doesn’t look good when the DEI editor (described above more like having a cause than a beat) is the one to axe the story. The further referral to the executive editor of Bloomberg Equality (which has an entire section on its site devoted to “DEI Backlash”: https://www.bloomberg.com/equality) is enough to make any reasonable person uneasy about how the editor arrived at her decision.
Regardless, I am hopeful that this is the first of many studies examining the effects of DEI trainings/orthodoxy. Given that this is one of the first studies on this subject matter that I’ve come across that actually has a control group, I think it’s a much better start on the path to understanding this topic than the Tumblr wisdom, pieced together critical theory, and vibes that have constituted what we know about the effects of these programs up to now.
All of this comes with the caveat that I too am highly skeptical about the results of many psych experiments having applications outside of the lab. However, we also have to remember that the road to a solid meta-analysis starts with a single study. Let’s hope there are more researchers willing to tackle this subject matter despite the social cost that they might face at their institutions.
All the News that Fits the Narrative and Suppress the Rest
But I do agree with not accepting the results until duplicated. Using Rutgers undergrads and online worker bees may not reflect society(ya think?!)
I think this is the major issue with many psych studies. Eighteen year old undergrads acting as a representative sample for everybody else in society never sat well with me.
Well especially 18 year old undergrads who were asked and know they are participating in a study.
These tid bits are indeed very damning. Having the DEI advocates can it is nothing like “usual editorial bullshit,” as it was described. Jesse, if you read this, did you know this?
Also I agree the studies sound a bit flimsy (and agree that this wouldn’t be a barrier to being discussed in the news if they found the opposite result)
It sounds like he had a pretty in depth convo about it semi off the record with the authors
Katie and Jesse take a very deserved victory lap, sounding more lighthearted than they have in recent episodes. I kept laughing aloud over my post-Thanksgiving dishes.
I'm still not going to admit to IRL friends that I love this podcast, but episodes like this one do give me hope!
I'm pretty sure they would have no clue what the podcast is, as any time I mention it to anyone they say "Oh, that sounds interesting."
I don't admit it either but truth is I could go around talking about it and nobody would know what I'm talking about or care.
On the JK Rowling thing: the suggestion that the Nazis burned down sex research facilities solely or even in large part due to "transphobia," is a lie of ommission. They viewed any kind of research on sex as "degenerate," and targeted homosexuals much more blatantly. There wasn't much of a distinction between cross-dressing and transsexualism back then; it was all just kind of lumped together in the broad category of "sexual deviance," especially in the eyes of the Nazi party. If any trans people were killed in the holocaust, it was for reasons other than being trans, most likely for either being Jewish or being homosexual.
There are records of who was killed for being gay, and there are accounts from gay people who survived the death camps (often to end up in prison after the war ended.) If so many trans people died in the holocaust, where are there names? Where are the stories from the ones who narrowly survived? I'd like to note for the record that one of the pioneers of the modern penile inversion vaginoplasty, Edwin Gohrbandt was himself a member of the Nazi party and even conducted experiments on prisoners at Dachau. If they were supposedly so transphobic, why did they employ this guy after he researched sex changes?
It's idiotic enough that they've tried to re-write history to make Stonewall all about themselves, but now they're trying to graft themselves onto the Holocaust as well. Ridiculous and offensive.
The most important point of why the man’s sex clinic was targeted was because he was JEWISH. He was a Jewish researcher about sex. Lgbt groups say the nazis were targeting them, but they were mostly targeting the fact the guy was Jewish. His partner who actually performed the sex change operations wasn’t Jewish and he went on to be in charge of the human experiments at Dachau (I think). I can’t remember the article I read about this but that article even said most gay men who were arrested were put in regular jail unless they were Jewish then they were sent to the camps. So this idea that lgbt people were specifically targeted is missing the main point: jews were the targets.
Also, sorry my tone is definitely angry in this comment. It’s not directed at you Wendy, just these asinine people who want to make everything about transness and gender woo. It’s so exhausting and it’s everywhere.
I didn't take your anger to be directed at me, haha. I understand completely; the experiences of other marginalized groups are ostensibly being appropriated by TRAs to bolster their narrative. If I recall correctly, there was actually a dropoff in the number of people being detained solely for homosexuality around 1940, because Hitler's priorities shifted to POWs and full-on extermination of Jewish people.
I think there's a discussion to be had about how poorly gay survivors (Jewish and gentile) were treated after the war, but that's less about who Hitler targeted in the Holocaust and more about the overall sociopolitical environment in the West at the time. The fact that some innocent people went from concentration camps to prison is unconscionable, and that particular component was the work of allied forces. As WWII retreats further into the past, more people tend to forget that fighting injustices against marginalized civilians was not the top priority of the Allied nations. Hitler was a uniquely evil man because he excelled at exploiting the bigotries that were latent in many people at the time, and he know how to weaponize them to accomplish truly horrific things. Both of my grandfathers served in WWII, and they both said blatantly antisemitic things on a somewhat regular basis, even after having personally witnessed the crimes of the Axis powers.
If people want to unpack historical injustices against Jews and gay people (among others), they have to acknowledge that the groundwork was laid for those crimes by pervasive endemic prejudices. The Nazis weaponized bigotry to the deadliest extent, but by no means was it unique to them.
Not gonna lie, I felt a lump in my throat when I saw Sam Brinton in that Trump ad.
A lump of yellow cake
Oh my gods Jesse do not join Blue Sky. You already cannot safely handle Twitter without getting into exhausting arguments with people who are not engaging in good faith.
I also joined Blue Sky out of curiosity and it's so boring, basically every post it shows me as "recommended" is Erin Reed (or equivalent) on trans issues or someone posting incredibly boring shit like "fuck Trump that's the message!" or "wow why does no one ever say eggs are ok for lunch, break breakfast boundaries y'all!".
Hard pass on fucking Trump. I don't understand why people say that.
Eggs for lunch?! NO WAY
KATIE DID YOU SEND THE LETTER?!??
Katie: "The gas cap is a glory hole"
Jesse: "That just reminded me of an amazing new Lonely Island video"
Jesse supports the Sushi Glory Hole concept: confirmed.
I just think we should hear them out
I don't think they can ever top "I'm On a Boat," though.
ETA: I've read y'all's replies and I stand by what I said.
“Jizz in my Pants” erasure.
"Mona Lisa" from "Popstar" is absolutely incredible.
“Jack Sparrow” is the one
...but he doesn't have a nautical-themed pashmina afghan!
If "All Lives Matter" is wrong, then it's certainly wrong to take the Holocaust and remove the specificity of it.
The Nazis burned Magnus Hirsch's library because he was JEWISH and subversive. The fact that he wrote about sexual and gender dysphoria (among other things) was secondary. Calling J.K. Rowling a "Holocaust Denier" is extremely dishonest.
In fact, the Nazis made a big production out of holding simultaneous book burnings in 34 towns. The fact that one of the book burnings contained books about sexual dysphoria is a footnote at best. (See https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/book-burning )
From this article about which books were burned:
> Other writers included on the blacklists were American authors Jack London, Theodore Dreiser, and Helen Keller, whose belief in social justice encouraged her to champion the disabled, pacifism, improved conditions for industrial workers, and women's voting rights.
We don't hear deaf-blind people saying that Hitler's first, primary victims were the deaf-blind simply because they burned Helen Keller's books.
Note the "critical" thinking questions on the bottom of this page about Jack London (https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/jack-london). Critical thinking is something a trans activist is incapable of.
I don’t usually comment on these, but the long weekend has given me too much free time so I just wanna say that I’m glad BarPod is addressing the DEI study Colin Wright wrote about but the state media ignored. I just read all the linked articles and will listen to the pod later. 😪